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Unread 11-20-2009, 05:46 PM   #1
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Default New engine in 94' Thunderbird

One of my roommates knows a guy selling a 94' Thunderird in great condition with a hydrolocked engine, and a 93' Mercury Cougar with a good engine and a beat up body...he'll sell us the pair for $800 (he owns his own racing team, and he's got more money than he knows what to do with lol). The both share the same chassis (I'm not sure yet which engines they have) so I'll have to check into that...but would you guys think it's worth it? (My initial inclination is HECK YEAH! but I wanted to see what you guys think.) Also, what am I likely to get from a junk yard for the chassis of the Cougar minus the engine?
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Unread 11-20-2009, 11:14 PM   #2
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if they are both the 4.6 then yeah, but if one or both is the 3.8 v6 no unless the working one is a super charged 3.8. if you do you should head on over to tccoa.com (thunderbird and cougar club of America). it's the place to get info about thunderbirds.

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Unread 11-21-2009, 04:36 AM   #3
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I say you should go for it. I recommend you save every last part you can off the bad body one, tho, before you junk it. Never know what you'll need for the blown engine car down the road. Basically, you'll be junking the unibody and sheet metal.


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if they are both the 4.6 then yeah, but if one or both is the 3.8 v6 no unless the working one is a super charged 3.8. if you do you should head on over to tccoa.com (thunderbird and cougar club of America). it's the place to get info about thunderbirds.
What's wrong with the 3.8 V6? They're tanks.
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Unread 11-21-2009, 07:55 AM   #4
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they blow head gaskets like no other, and they just don't have the resale value to make the $800 a really good deal. also if only one is a v6 the swap is going to be a lot harder than a v8 to v8 swap as they use different wiring / ecu's. it would be worth the extra effort if the donor is the s/c v6, but not if it's n/a.

my last car was a 97 3.8 Thunderbird lol. I was constantly saying "coulda had a V8 "

Last edited by [email protected]; 11-21-2009 at 08:00 AM.

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Unread 11-21-2009, 08:57 AM   #5
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lol.
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Yeah. Should hold up fine, long as you don't drive like a primate.

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Unread 11-21-2009, 09:24 AM   #6
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Only one I can come up with that blew head gaskets did so because a FRAM oil filter came apart and plugged up oil passages in the heads. They then overheated and warped.


That engine has since had about 100K of VERY rough handling since, and it was at 75-100K when the FRAM bomb went off.


Blows head gaskets....yeah...


As far as resale value....For starters, the only reason it's not a good reseller is because it's a V6. People in America malign the V6 in general, claiming it's weak, yet uses a ton of gas. Secondly, resale value has no bearing on the reliability or dependability of an engine, nor does it affect performance, so I fail to see how this factors in at all. Cars are built to be kept untill they're barely worth more than their weight in scrap anyways.
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My rigs:

1985 Ford F150 | 4x2 | 300ci OHV inline six | 4-speed OD manual | 310K | No power brakes | Running 100% - It hasn't driven this good in 15 years!

1984 Ford F150 | 4x2 | 300ci six | granny four | 3.55 rear end | 210K | Brakes shot. Rear drums are doing most of the work. Not fit to drive due to that.
1997 Ford Explorer XLT | 4.0L Vulcan V6 | 5-speed automatic | shift-on-the-fly 4WD | 210,000 miles | Running 95% - Needs brakes on all four corners + bald tires
1989 Ford F150 | 300cid six...again | 5-speed | 4x4 | 160K | Needs brakes done as well. Oi!

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Unread 11-21-2009, 09:41 AM   #7
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http://forums.tccoa.com/showthread.php?t=124257

Quote:
It is not a given that your gaskets will blow but it is a known flaw with Ford's 3.8. Whether or not you change them on a good motor is up for debate. The main reason they blow is due to the restrictive exhaust. Replace the downtubes and put on some high-flow catalytic converters and you will likely see another 100k miles out of her.
If you have the time and funds to do the gaskets then maybe you should go ahead, it is a good time to get the engine bay cleaned up and replace any sensors and vacuum lines. If you do, be sure to replace the head bolts with ARP head studs and quality gaskets. (I am partial to the MLS head gaskets.) Whether you change the gaskets or not, you still need to replace the restrictive exhaust.
(The reason why they blow usually isn't exhaust restrictiveness. that was cleared up later in the thread)
http://forums.tccoa.com/showthread.p...ht=head+gasket

They do go through head gaskets...

the 3.8 V6 in the thunderbird makes 140 HP and gets 24 mpg highway http://www.fueleconomy.gov/FEG/noframes/11010.shtml

the 4.6 makes 200 HP and gets 23
http://www.fueleconomy.gov/FEG/noframes/11012.shtml

that along with the COMMON head gasket failure around 100k miles (cars of this age will probably be over 100k), makes it have a poor resale value, and poorer reliability than the V8 while making less power, and at a cost of only 1 mpg.

Last edited by [email protected]; 11-21-2009 at 09:51 AM.

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Unread 11-21-2009, 12:26 PM   #8
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Dude.....those MPG estimates fail.


1. They're just highway miles. Come back with city and combined.
2. Find some real world tests. EPA is horribly inaccurate. In 1985, they gave my truck a 30MPG highway rating(LOLOLOLOL). Even today, adjusting for various factors and knowledge increases over the years, it still retains an EPA estimate significantly higher than it really gets. I'm thinking it gets 13/18(Using 55MPH as highway) or 13/15 for interstate travel @ 75-80MPH, they're saying 15/19 last time I checked. Too high, in fact, for me to have used the truck as a clunker in the Cash for Clunkers scam. Not that I would have.

You can see it's specs in my sig, if you're curious.


The biggest hole in your argument is listed right in your argument.
Quote:
(cars of this age will probably be over 100k)
Chances are, if the engine's made it past the failure point, it's not going to fail anytime soon. That head gasket will last just as long as the head gasket in any other engine on the road.
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My rigs:

1985 Ford F150 | 4x2 | 300ci OHV inline six | 4-speed OD manual | 310K | No power brakes | Running 100% - It hasn't driven this good in 15 years!

1984 Ford F150 | 4x2 | 300ci six | granny four | 3.55 rear end | 210K | Brakes shot. Rear drums are doing most of the work. Not fit to drive due to that.
1997 Ford Explorer XLT | 4.0L Vulcan V6 | 5-speed automatic | shift-on-the-fly 4WD | 210,000 miles | Running 95% - Needs brakes on all four corners + bald tires
1989 Ford F150 | 300cid six...again | 5-speed | 4x4 | 160K | Needs brakes done as well. Oi!

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Unread 11-21-2009, 12:36 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TestECull View Post
Dude.....those MPG estimates fail.


1. They're just highway miles. Come back with city and combined.
2. Find some real world tests. EPA is horribly inaccurate. In 1985, they gave my truck a 30MPG highway rating(LOLOLOLOL). Even today, adjusting for various factors and knowledge increases over the years, it still retains an EPA estimate significantly higher than it really gets. I'm thinking it gets 13/18(Using 55MPH as highway) or 13/15 for interstate travel @ 75-80MPH, they're saying 15/19 last time I checked. Too high, in fact, for me to have used the truck as a clunker in the Cash for Clunkers scam. Not that I would have.

You can see it's specs in my sig, if you're curious.


The biggest hole in your argument is listed right in your argument. Chances are, if the engine's made it past the failure point, it's not going to fail anytime soon. That head gasket will last just as long as the head gasket in any other engine on the road.
You should see the Ford Fusion we just got in. Sticker on the door, EPA estimates (just about always above what you'll actually get) was 20 city and 24 highway. This thing had a 2.3L 4 banger in it. Should be pulling 30mpg easy. My 4.3 gets the same mileage
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Unread 11-21-2009, 12:48 PM   #10
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Rofl. It probably does in the real world. I know someone that got a brand new 4cyl manual Fusion, but he hadn't had it long enough to burn through an entire tank last time we chatted.
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Tired Iron ain't got no time to wear out...

My rigs:

1985 Ford F150 | 4x2 | 300ci OHV inline six | 4-speed OD manual | 310K | No power brakes | Running 100% - It hasn't driven this good in 15 years!

1984 Ford F150 | 4x2 | 300ci six | granny four | 3.55 rear end | 210K | Brakes shot. Rear drums are doing most of the work. Not fit to drive due to that.
1997 Ford Explorer XLT | 4.0L Vulcan V6 | 5-speed automatic | shift-on-the-fly 4WD | 210,000 miles | Running 95% - Needs brakes on all four corners + bald tires
1989 Ford F150 | 300cid six...again | 5-speed | 4x4 | 160K | Needs brakes done as well. Oi!

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